Recovery isn't a straight line; it's a mosaic of triumphs, setbacks, and revelations that shape us into who we are. Embark on a motivational journey with Jake, whose candid account of overcoming addiction through the Valiant Living program will touch your heart and ignite your spirit. Our conversation traverses the landscape of personal growth, as Jake speaks to the essence of humility in sobriety, dismantles initial doubts about the program, and celebrates the ‘Valiant Difference’ — a blend of support, camaraderie, and unexpected moments of joy, like the surprise call from Jill that underscores the community's tight-knit fabric.
Ever caught yourself wondering how certain habits sneak into our lives and cling like shadows? Jake's intimate reflection on his battle with unhealthy coping mechanisms pulls back the curtain on a topic that many grapple with in silence. He traces his own behaviors back to their roots, recounting the voids that gambling filled, and the courage it took to confront his issues head-on. His story is a powerful testament to the strength found in vulnerability, the cathartic release of acknowledging one's struggles, and the indelible impact of a supportive network through the monumental shifts of recovery.
As we step behind the closed doors of intensive therapy, Jake sheds light on the resilience of the human spirit. He details the rigorous routine of group sessions, individual therapy, and 12-step meetings that carved his path to self-awareness, alongside the transformative power of emotional intelligence and empathy. Further, he underscores the significance of holistic practices and the practical tools he gained for managing anxiety and life's myriad pressures. Infused with hope and actionable guidance, this episode is an open invitation to anyone seeking to embrace change and cultivate a fulfilling, sober life.
Recovery isn't a straight line; it's a mosaic of triumphs, setbacks, and revelations that shape us into who we are. Embark on a motivational journey with Jake, whose candid account of overcoming addiction through the Valiant Living program will touch your heart and ignite your spirit. Our conversation traverses the landscape of personal growth, as Jake speaks to the essence of humility in sobriety, dismantles initial doubts about the program, and celebrates the ‘Valiant Difference’ — a blend of support, camaraderie, and unexpected moments of joy, like the surprise call from Jill that underscores the community's tight-knit fabric.
Ever caught yourself wondering how certain habits sneak into our lives and cling like shadows? Jake's intimate reflection on his battle with unhealthy coping mechanisms pulls back the curtain on a topic that many grapple with in silence. He traces his own behaviors back to their roots, recounting the voids that gambling filled, and the courage it took to confront his issues head-on. His story is a powerful testament to the strength found in vulnerability, the cathartic release of acknowledging one's struggles, and the indelible impact of a supportive network through the monumental shifts of recovery.
As we step behind the closed doors of intensive therapy, Jake sheds light on the resilience of the human spirit. He details the rigorous routine of group sessions, individual therapy, and 12-step meetings that carved his path to self-awareness, alongside the transformative power of emotional intelligence and empathy. Further, he underscores the significance of holistic practices and the practical tools he gained for managing anxiety and life's myriad pressures. Infused with hope and actionable guidance, this episode is an open invitation to anyone seeking to embrace change and cultivate a fulfilling, sober life.
Well, hey, everyone. Welcome to the Valiant Living podcast, where we educate, encourage and empower you towards a life of peace and freedom. I'm your host, Drew Powell, and I'm a grateful alumni of the Valiant Living program. Valiant Living offers hope and transformational change to men and their families struggling with addiction and mental health challenges. So on this podcast you'll hear from the Valiant team, as well as stories of alumni who are living in recovery. If you or someone you love is struggling to overcome addiction or trauma, please call us at 720-756-7941 or you can email admissions at valiantlivingcom. We'd love to have a conversation with you, but for now, let's dive into today's episode. Jake man, thanks for joining the Valiant Living podcast.
Speaker 2:Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1:You're what we affectionately call a valiant victory. How does that feel?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean I'll take it. I appreciate it. It hasn't been too long, but hopefully we'll be staying a valiant victory story for a long time.
Speaker 1:It's weird because that is how it feels man. It feels like we're taking day to time. So it's hard to. At one point you get kind of not confident in your sobriety. But you know your plan works. But at the same time you're kind of taught to stay humble so that you don't.
Speaker 2:Sorry, that's Jill calling me, you didn't really get it, get it All right, hold on.
Speaker 1:Tell her we're recording.
Speaker 2:Hey, jill, you're live on the Valiant Victory podcast with Drew Powell. Jill, how are you listening to? I think you're actually doing it right now. Oh, we're, we are. You're live. You're being recorded, so watch yourself Disgusting. I'll be right home on the podcast. Well, that's hilarious.
Speaker 1:Hi, Drew. Hey Look, it's like two of my favorite people. See, there you go. I don't even know what to do with myself. We're still recording. We were about a minute into the introduction and you called in. I told him just get it. Just let Jill Interrupt the podcast. I'm so sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt.
Speaker 2:In fairness, she is returning my call, so that's on me, it is. It is a return phone call. Well, mr Doxer, if you want to return my call after you share your Valiant Victory, that will be spectacular. I will. I will do that. I will do that. I will do that. I will do that. I will do that. I will do that. I will do that. Okay, all right, bye, bye.
Speaker 1:YouTube See.
Speaker 2:I mean that might be the best intro you can get. That's the Valiant Difference.
Speaker 1:The Valiant Difference. I love it.
Speaker 2:Oh man.
Speaker 1:They're great, man. That's what I do, that's what I love. They care about us, man. They really do Totally. And there's probably moments I'm sure you had them too where you wonder like hey, do they really have my best interest, because we're just bucking against the system so hard.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2:I don't. Yeah, I had. I have all lot of really good things to say about Valiant. My start wasn't the smoothest, yeah, and so I definitely had those thoughts of like to these people really even give you know care.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:And you know 99% of the people, yeah, they do really really care. You don't really. You can't validate it or it's not proven until I think, until you leave. Honestly, sure, it's like once you're not there, if you still are keeping in touch with these people and they're still calling to check up on you and want to talk and, you know, want to give advice, like that, that is, you know there's no incentive, right and like their model is not like you know, client retention.
Speaker 1:No, no, so like Right.
Speaker 2:And like this isn't business development. To keep in touch, that would be kind of unethical, you could say. But you know they do really care and you know I think, especially in the beginning, you're, you're. I walked in I didn't really know what to expect but I was like what, yeah I? What the heck am I getting myself into? This is so, so weird. Like they're a fan of the Valiant family and these, like you know, you're going to be part of the family for a life. I don't want to be. I want to be here at 90 days and I want to get back to my life and and and then by the time I left, it was like I don't even this is I. I need to go back to my life, but I love it here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know, do you know, valiant family for life is is you know, and now it's interesting to see, like, how that kind of the cycle goes. And you know, in the beginning you're like pushing back against everything.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And it's like what am I doing here with these guys? I don't know any of these people they're. These guys are not like me, I'm not like them, I have nothing in common with these guys. And then by the end, you're like these guys are my brothers. Man, it's just so crazy, the transition that happens.
Speaker 2:It's so weird. It's like I went from living in an apartment my wife, my dog, to like and I didn't have a roommate after college. This is the first time I had a roommate since college. Yeah, and like, all of a sudden, you're in a house with, like you know, anywhere from seven to 14 dudes, right, and I, my first roommate was, we say, to say we had absolutely nothing in common, yeah, and it could not have been more different people, and it's like I'm so weird. But, yeah, you know you, you, you know it's, it's you become a band of brothers, hopefully. And you know, I think for many people most of us, myself certainly, like I was never really good with guys, very, yeah, you know, like and and and like my peers, I guess you could say, okay, so that was, like you know, definitely a point of anxiety and you know it, it, it definitely helped, that for sure. That's amazing. I mean, I keep in touch with these guys, do all the time, every day.
Speaker 1:That's amazing. That's amazing. Yeah, I try to. I've been bad about getting on the alumni zoom lately and all that kind of stuff. But I love it when I can jump on there and keep in touch. But it's like it's one of those things where, like, even if I, you know it's been a month or two, it's like we pick right back up, like there's just a bond that's just kind of locked in, you know, forever. We'll run us back to the beginning. Man, tell us a little bit about your life, your story, your journey, before coming into valiant.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I grew up in right outside of Washington DC and Bethesda, maryland, to a very loving mother and father. I have a younger brother who's two years younger and a younger sister who's eight years younger. She's the boss Yep, take orders from a 24 year old 23 year old Again, show for that. And, you know, grew up, had a great kind of upbringing, was the first grandchild on both sides of my family and the first, obviously the first child said there's a lot, of, a lot of a pressure and kind of expectations that I always was striving to meet and seemingly always not meeting, so kind of that golden child for everyone Until I wasn't. And, yeah, that that's like you know. Then I went to the University of Michigan and graduated in 2014 and started working and here I am 10 years later. That's, you know, that's the kind of the short of it. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I love that. What was there a moment in your life where you started to see some early signs of you know, I was gonna say addiction, but we're taught in in valiant, like a lot of a lot of ways, regardless of your addiction. They're just unhealthy copes, right, we all have our things that we go to that are unhealthy for us to help us cope with whatever trauma or whatever we're dealing with in life. And I'm sure now, on hindsight, after you've done so much work, you've probably, you know, have a clear picture on it. But was there a moment where you got like, hey, I have an unhealthy cope here in my life is becoming unmanageable. What was that? What was that like in your life?
Speaker 2:And yeah, I mean, let's like I think, before doing a lot of kind of work on it and kind of looking back and really putting my life under a microscope, I would have said, you know, at the end of my first job, I kind of found myself in a position where I was sitting around and waiting for the next step to happen, matt, you know, it was supposed to be two months or three months and it became four months, five months, six months, and I was in an apartment by myself in DC and I that I was, I mean, I was lonely, to be honest, and it was right at the same time that there was a casino opening in National Harbor, outside like 15 minutes away, and I started going there, like at night, during the week I was summer, like it was, you know and it was like that was probably the the first time I like went to the bank and had to call ahead and ask them for like to get cash above my, like, atm limit. I think was probably the first time. I was like, oh shit, this is a problem. That wasn't the first time I gambled, certainly, but leaving the casino like three or four days in a row at 637am definitely like stopping for breakfast on the way home. It's like, definitely I like oh God, oh boy.
Speaker 2:But you know, I, I think I could probably go back to oh man, like even younger, to like to think about, like what we're like. When was I kind of like? What are some of the signs? I think I was generally a very well behaved kid, like, certainly had my moments growing up and, you know, picked up a nasty habit or two in high school Sure, chewing tobacco, which you know to this day is like maybe the biggest red line in my, in my, in my family life and and in my marriage.
Speaker 2:But yeah, no, I, you know I, I I played the cross in college. That kind of team structure was always a huge part of my life and it wasn't until that was kind of ripped away when I tore my hip up and had to have surgery, and that it wasn't until that moment where, like, that team aspect was completely just just gone, that I realized how important and stabilizing that had been in my life. And that's probably that, you know, senior junior year, senior year of college, was when kind of things started to accelerate to that point where, you know, two and a half years later, when I was had just finished on my first job when things really got super out of hand.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So, as much as you're comfortable, I love to hear just what was the the moment that kind of led you to like, hey, I need to go get some help here, I'm going to go and I'm going to, I'm going to go to Valiant and because you ended up and we'll get into this, but you were, you there longer than 90 days.
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, yeah I think I think there's one person stayed longer than me ever.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:Number two in the house.
Speaker 1:Well, dude, that's great. I mean, who does you? For a lot of guys it's really hard to stay in, especially stay longer. I know when I went I was like I committed to 90 and I was not going to stay 90 and a half days, like when I went in there. Now I will say, like you said earlier, when you at first it's like a struggle or anything else by the time you get to 90, like I wept in the hall my last day.
Speaker 1:I was so sad. It's such a sacred place. Now I was ready to go back to Nashville and get back to my life and anything else, but I was torn. Man, I like that was family, that was home and it was like it became such a sacred place. So I get it. So like I think someone on the front end hearing you stayed longer is like I can't imagine. But it's like once you get into it and you realize in the work that's being done and you're realizing like hey, for some of us it's taken us 40 years to get this jacked up, 90 days in a grand scheme of life is really not that long a time to untangle a lot of this stuff. So credit to you for staying. But yeah, what was that? What was that moment where you're like, hey, I got to go with some help.
Speaker 2:Well, it's funny, I'll just, I'll quickly just add to the the time part, like yeah.
Speaker 1:I come into 60 days. Oh, okay, wow.
Speaker 2:I don't know that that, that that Pete would see it that way. But but you know, I remember asking I think it was Pete or Campbell, like on the form that they are like pamphlet they sent me. It said like 30 to 45 days for each step. It's like phase one, phase two, yeah, 35 days both of them. And I was like so what's the difference between? And I'm like negotiating, I don't even realize it Like what's the difference between 30 and 45 days? Like what, how do those two people look? What's different about them? Right, and they're like, well, it's just you know the effort, or something like that. And I was like, all right, well, mark me down for 60 days, because I'm doing 30 days for each. I'm the most committed person you've ever had and I'm gonna get out of there and then like okay, yeah, yeah yeah, get out here, we'll see you and come see in two days.
Speaker 2:60 days, you got buddy, that's great. Bring your golf clubs Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, which will go down, as perhaps the funniest part of the whole treatment was. I did show up with my golf clubs. I was told to bring them. I used them once in six months.
Speaker 1:Really so it ended up being a no-transcript.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I ended. So I it was kind of June of this past year, so June 2023. You know, I didn't really know what was going on. I, by this point, I had known I had lost myself and who I was and I was just kind of floundering and like drifting through life in a way. That was like the path of least resistance and most kind of like numb you know existence, this kind of like slinking my way through and trying to be unseen and unheard and just kind of like just getting to like whatever the next thing was and doing as little as possible to move to the next step of life. But the one thing I did know and I realized, you know pretty clearly in June was like I, I continued to hurt the people I loved the most and the people in my life you know, primarily my wife, but my, my parents, my brothers, my sisters, you know cousins, best friends, friends, you know people that I looked up to as brothers like I just continued to hurt these people that I loved and I didn't know why I was doing it.
Speaker 2:I certainly knew how I was doing it, but I couldn't stop doing it and I would be apologetic and I would feel remorse and I'd be guilty and I'd feel shame and the lots of shame, lots of guilt. But the same cycle would repeat itself over and over and it got to a point where, like, something had to change. It was kind of that it's like do or die time, not not in the you know suicide, suicide sense, but just like I thankfully like had this moment where it's like I got to change something or I'm gonna lose everything. And you know, that was a big, that was the big kind of moment. And I asked my therapist, I told him I call my therapist and I said you know where, what's one of you why I got to go somewhere.
Speaker 2:I got to do something different and like an hour later I was talking to his friend and she said you're going to Valiant and I said awesome. Before I can change my mind.
Speaker 1:Exactly. Well, that is a big part of it, right, like and I think even we say it with like kind of tongue in cheek about 30 days, 60 days, nine days, whatever. But a big part of it is they're just trying to get us there, yeah, so they can evaluate and see where we're at. And you know, I remember kicking, screaming the first little bit too, about you know how long do I have to stay in PHP versus going to IOP? And they're really just looking at you know my level of surrender and I was similar to you.
Speaker 1:I was like I'm going to do all the coursework, I'm going to do everything. I was doing stuff before they asked me, showing up with stuff done, just ready to kind of ace the whole program. And they're like looking at me, like come on, man, like we see through guys like you, like we see you guys all the time, you know. So it's like a lot of guys in the program are high achieving people, you know and so, but they're just interior. World is kind of kind of falling apart. So I'm curious so you get the valiant, you're show up in Denver with your golf clubs ready to crush this thing. You're going to be the best you know. Student.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, my best performing client ever, in and out, 60 days unheard of.
Speaker 1:They're going to give you. Yeah, they're going to let you out on good behavior early, yeah. So what was? What was that process like, though that first, like few weeks, month for you conveyance that beginning stages of your recovery?
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's interesting, I think, like the first. It's so funny because, as I obviously spent much longer time there than most and it allowed me to kind of see this happen to other people too, as they kind of came in, but like the first couple of weeks that they had probably took me like two weeks to settle down a little bit, like I think I described it as like the new car smell, or like you're kind of running on adrenaline and excitement and like you know, and like you know take trying to take it all in, but like you're just moving 100 miles per hour because it's new and it's different and you know you're going to be out of here in eight weeks. And you know, and it's funny, like I think even talking to therapists, like they, they would say like, yeah, like we had to wait for you to settle in, yeah, before we even got to work, and that really took two weeks for sure, like at least. Then one morning you wake up and you're like, not like whoa, let's go to group therapy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, here we come, yeah, and like it gets harder and harder to wake up early, and you know you're the people like doing the dishes starts to piss you off and you know like clanking of the plates and what the you know what not, and you start getting annoyed by who's changing the channel. You know like when you start to get annoyed by that's normal stuff again, it's like when it's like all right, you're here, You're, you're, it's now, it's time to get into work. Get to work.
Speaker 1:I spent five weeks, five and a half weeks, in PHP Before I moved to IOP and so for people that don't know, that's, that's intense, that's five and a half weeks of intense work, man. That's like group therapy, individual therapy, 12 step groups. I mean 30 plus hours a week of like just picture boot camp therapy for five and a half weeks, which takes a certain amount of mental and emotional stamina to do, yeah, to do.
Speaker 2:I mean you're, you're programming. You're in programming what from 8am to 2pm and you have individual meetings for two more hours after that. So you're looking like eight to four. You're out and about and you're doing stuff, yeah, and heavy stuff it's not. You know easy work, Deep work, and then and then you have to go to a 12 step meeting or you know you have to do homework, Like it's like, it's like not fun. I mean it's not supposed to be. I mean you try to make the best of it and you're going to have your days, but it's really really intense. Crash course in, in, in therapy and work on yourself.
Speaker 1:I remember going to 12 step meetings in the evening, being so agitated after a day Like I'm just so. I've been triggered all day, I've been taught and I'm just like I'm falling asleep. I'm just like I can't believe we have to leave the house again, get in that van and go to a 12 step meeting tonight. You know, but that's part of us breaking down some entitlement stuff that I had. I mean, it's like that's a big part of the work. Man, is that in between?
Speaker 2:stuff. I mean, I think I think, apart from having to live with people, my second biggest like source of anxiety was 12 step meetings. I was like always had like always felt taboo to me, yeah, and like what are these going to be like? Is it going to be a bunch like you know, junkies and you know, but like so that was really scary. The going to the first meeting which I actually did my first day there it was on zoom, so I guess that doesn't really count, but like that was like, yeah, I had so much anxiety around that. Yeah, now I need to go to keep myself sane, which is a huge one.
Speaker 1:The very thing that gave you anxiety before is the thing that brings you peace now. It's wild, that's, that's cool. Well, man, tell us. So you're just kind of unpack the story here, so you get in treatment. Where was the moment where you're kind of like, hey, this is, I'm starting to see some change here? I'm starting to see like, was there any? And maybe it's on a moment right, because I know it's day by day. But I'm even curious just how did you come to the conclusion of I need to stay longer past 60 days?
Speaker 2:I'd love to say it was my choice, at least initially. It was funny, I think, like I will. I will say, like I think that there was a lot of changes that I was starting to see in myself that convinced me like this is what I should be doing right now. This is going to be great. You know, I I don't know if I can really pinpoint the exact moment where I was like, oh, things are changing. I'd pretty rough go for the first month and a half. Really, that PHP time was not the smoothest for me and yeah, you know, I don't know and I think, well before I got to 90 days, I was kind of telegraphed to me like, hey, buddy, don't pack your bags, I'm going anywhere, you know, like you know, and don't even try to go to your parents or your wife, like they're not going to help you here. They're in agreement.
Speaker 1:So the parents and wife were kind of on board with you need to stay longer, which probably helped you, motivate you to stay right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think you know. For me it was. You know, ultimately I got to. I got to three months. I think that that third month was like frustrating. There would been like there was like a Jewish holiday that I really wanted to be home for In September. I kind of it always kind of had Memorial Day weekend on my calendar is like I'm gonna be home for that, yeah, gotta be, and that was like so not happening.
Speaker 1:It's funny how we set markers. Even for me it was like football games. I was like, well, I'll be home by this football game to watch with my like it. Just I needed something to be like, because at the beginning, if you said 60 days or 90 days, you might have said 90 years. It just felt like I'm, this is the rest of my life. So I needed to be like, oh well, at least by Thanksgiving I'll be. You know, we just kind of make these markers up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, it went, sorry. Yeah, it went from like Memorial Day to Thanksgiving. That was like the first, like alright, I'll give up that, I'll be here Memorial Day. Then it was Thanksgiving. Then it was the Michigan Ohio State football game, which I guess is kind of Thanksgiving.
Speaker 2:And you know, coach Dan, big Ohio State fan, and you know he kept making the joke like you're going to be here for that game, buddy, you're going to be here and yeah, I'm not going to be here, but we're going to beat you guys, no matter what, it doesn't matter where I am. And and then I think was like Jill would always joke about. You know, we have a great Hanukkah here, we have a great Hanukkah program and I'm like that's in December, like there's no way, no way, spoiler. I definitely was there for like the first night at Hanukkah. But yeah, it's, it's it. It's funny. I felt like, even as it got later, the first, like that first, like extra month fourth month was I was like I got to get out of here. The fifth month I was like I'm staying, I'm doing another month, I and I started in the sixth. You know five, six months, and that's when I started kind of going back home, going to Chicago, seeing my wife, seeing my family.
Speaker 2:I went home for Thanksgiving, actually, and then went back to Denver, which was reintegrating a little bit back into the back in the yeah and just like having all these kind of uncomfortable situations and high you know you know stress environments of Thanksgiving being back in my childhood home and then having a safe place where I could go back to after and process and talk about what went wrong, what went well, what did I do when situations came up and just like kind of that, that debrief was probably the best thing that I could have done.
Speaker 2:Yeah, as much as I hated right, you know not, I hate, but you know I pushed back a lot, but but selfishly, and then quickly was like this is the right thing. Yeah, it didn't hurt that we had the membership at the club Greenwood. Yeah, that was. I mean, I think, apart from the work that I did in the, in the rooms and individual therapy and whatnot, I think the biggest transformation I made I lost. I think I lost 55 pounds and when I was at Valiant I've lost a little bit more sense. I think we're stopping the weight loss now. It's over.
Speaker 2:But, yeah, I showed up. I was like 230 pounds, which I was shocked. When I stepped on the scale, I knew I was way out of shape. I'd been, you know, an athlete in college and was, I think, like 170 pounds in college, 175 pounds. And I got to Valiant. I stepped on the scale of the gym. It was 130, 230. And I was like, oh, and that was no muscle either.
Speaker 1:Right Right Wasn't like that was muscle weight.
Speaker 2:Oh, and between you know, I was there summer and fall and we played a ton of pickleball, just a ton of. You know you have so much time to work on yourself in the gym, which I think is just as important. Yeah, you know mind, body, soul that. You know that transformation was a huge motivation, motivating factor for me to continue working on other parts of my life. Um, because I was, you know, seeing progress in the gym and and in my how I felt about myself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's incredible. Well, what was one of your most challenging parts of your recovery, or your recovery process? Kind of wallet, valiant, or even after work? If someone's listening to this right now and kind of hearing your story and we'll, we'll get to kind of post valiant, kind of how you're living recovery now the victory part, but someone listening. What was some of your challenges, or maybe your biggest one? Oh, man.
Speaker 2:Um, I mean, I'm my biggest challenge. I think it's probably a cheap answer, but you know, getting on to my own way For me, I think I showed up to valiant with very low emotional intelligence. I had feelings. I didn't know what they were, I didn't know how to express them, I certainly didn't know how to deal with them, which is why I was so destructive in my coping mechanisms, of which there were many and unhealthy ones, at least, you know, I think, my, you know, coming to coming to terms with, like this, this, you know, idea that you know, my life story is a story of entitlement and whether I like it or not, like, I had to, just I had to accept that and recognize how it's played a point, factor in in all these different stages of my life and and, and you know where I am now.
Speaker 2:But really, for me, the emotional intelligence stuff was, was, was, I think, the biggest thing for me, I mean being able to identify what is that, what am I feeling? Is it anger, is it frustration? Is it? Is it happiness, is it sadness? Like what is it? And and then getting the tools to process and deal with those emotions in a healthy way was, was, you know, huge, I think. The other one I would add that was huge for me was empathy. I had none. I knew what it was. My wife's a clinical psychologist but I I certainly didn't know really what it was and how to have it show it. So that was probably, if you ask people, my life, the probably the biggest, biggest transformation. Yeah.
Speaker 1:So that uses a lot of different modalities and it's kind of a unique approach to treatment. At least that I that I found. What? Was there any experience or aspect of the program that you kind of gravitated into or found, you know, particularly impactful for you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm going to give a shout out, okay, melissa.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, I mean, I think, for me the mindfulness practice the yoga practice, kind of the, the soul and body part, was just as important as the kind of the mind part. Yeah, I think that's a really good point. As the kind of the mind part. You know my some of my best sessions I felt like where I had learned the most about myself. Or with Melissa talking about whatever it was, whether it was breathing exercises, you know, just general mindfulness, yeah, that was a huge, huge. It was something I always liked.
Speaker 2:But even before valiant, but always like dismissed, as like I don't have time for that, yeah, it's funny, like how little I had time for before I went to valiant, but you know, always found fun, time to gamble or do whatever, but I didn't have time to, you know, spend one minute doing a mindfulness practice. So I mean, I think, apart from the room and general group therapy, kind of the what you would consider traditional treatment, that that, what Melissa's program was, has profoundly impacted me in a positive way and it's something that I think about and I practice and I come back to multiple times a day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, For those listening, Melissa is obviously on staff, but she's a wellness director and so part of the program is is like you were saying earlier, Jake. I mean, they're really emphasizing the holistic approach. So yoga in the mornings, or maybe it's just a meditation, or it's something at the gym, or it's a hike, or it's doing something getting our bodies moving and active and kind of getting back in to our bodies. You know, sometimes I talk about having an out of body experience where it goes, but it's actually like there's part of it's like coming back into your body and like you're saying, what do you feel? And Melissa is really brilliant at helping us kind of tap into those things. And and, like you said, just slow down, right, it's like life goes so fast.
Speaker 1:I've found, even after valiant and I don't know if you're this way or not, but I still crave a slowness and I'm at war with it constantly. Now that I'm back, integrated back into the the quote, unquote real world, right, which is, you know, I'd say that tongue in cheek but life moves so fast and I'm and now I'm like it's unsettling for me I still crave slowness and stillness and quiet and being present. Are you that way, Are you finding that post valiant, Like it's a little clunky, knowing how to like, especially you're in a big city, you know I'm I'm not going to give your address here, but you're, you know you're part of a. You're in a big city, right? There's a lot of activity in life around you. How do you maintain some of those practices now?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, one of the things that I think probably most people are terrified about when they show up on day one is like the digital detox, like they take your phone and they don't. They don't take your phone, but like you know your first two weeks you have what.
Speaker 2:An hour a day first, two weeks ish, so no one as well. He said on the podcast two weeks. So where's my phone? Yeah, Like and like. That's anxiety provoking at first, but what I found is like by the end of my two weeks I was like you can keep it. I don't. You know, the phone is everything. You have so much power in that, in your hand. It's like you're so accessible that things just ramp up and move so fast and that you know, yeah, it's.
Speaker 2:I'm in a city, there's hustle and bustle and you can hear the train, you know, screaming by and you know long ambulances still bug me. I have, like, you know, that's like, if I can't I mean New York, for example, I don't live there, there's a hint, but like I could never get over the fact that I felt like I was always hearing an ambulance. But yeah, I think when you get to valiant, there's like you hit, you reset everything and so much of like all of us. You know, we all share a couple of things in common and one of that is that like, go, go, go, mine moves a million miles a second. You know, and and you know we're just grabbing and taking, taking, taking, taking and just running through the day. So just that, that reset is it's, it is peaceful and it's something that I do.
Speaker 2:I would say I do struggle with kind of maintaining and even, you know, even like this week, for instance, like I, my birthday is coming up and I'm feeling, I was feeling super overwhelmed. Like you know, there was just stuff that like the normal person I don't say the normal person, but like you know, someone better than me, better equipped than me, like could handle, but like I had to really like pause, step back and just take some time for me and some space for me so that I could, like methodically do the things that I had to do for me. And then you know you can't give what you don't have yourself, like then I can, then I can tell you what I want for dinner on Friday night. You know it's, you know that sounds simple, but like, with those requests pile up and your phone is right there and it's like if you don't respond in two minutes they're like you know, hey, got a question mark on them on the on the text bubble. It can get overwhelming.
Speaker 1:I totally relate to that. Well, thanks for sharing that part of it, because I think a lot of people listening, especially people like me, that I, you know, deal with anxiety. It can be simple, things stacked up that I get super overwhelmed with and those are the things that used to make me act out because I just didn't know how to relieve that. And it's like, and if I listed the things that made me overwhelmed, if I said out loud you'd be like that's ridiculous, but it was my anxiety that was just piled up. And now, like you know, I've got tools. I can even a simple as making a list and getting it out of my head and just seeing like, okay, this is all the stuff that's happening. Okay, that's not that big I, you know, I can handle it. But if I don't have tools, it's easier just to escape those feelings of pressure or stress or anxiety or the weight I'm carrying. And so I appreciate you sharing that, because I feel less alone when I hear other guys like hey, this is me too, you know.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's so funny. Like you know, the other day I did make a list of all the things I had to do and it was like four different areas of town for different stores. I had to return something, I had to pick something up and, like you know, I'm doing all these kinds of errands and I made a list, I did them. I just had to start at number one and just went to Target, right, and then it was like all right uptown to whatever Crate and Barrel or Container Store, free ads.
Speaker 2:This episode, brought to you by yeah, list of things and I did it. I said so someone last night. Like I did, I did everything on my list. It was the most inefficient way of doing it, like I was going uptown, downtown, around, but I did them all and I'm sure it took longer than it probably had to. But you know, sometimes you just need to get back to the basics of like, all right, I have four things to do today. I'm going to do them whatever list way you know, write them down. But yeah, it's, it's. Yeah, I think you know it's easy to.
Speaker 2:It's really easy to get overwhelmed and, like you said, I mean I, when, when life gets tough, I would chose the easy way out, which was like to escape, to act out, to gamble, like whatever it was that particular day, and maybe it was all of them like that was my way of kind of numbing and making life less hard and not to deal with the stuff that I had to do. You know, and so you know it's. It's important to be mindful of those moments when you're getting to that point where, like, okay, life's about life's getting overwhelming, or I'm feeling overwhelmed in this moment. Now let me go back to my, to all the things that I learned at Valiant and Denver and let me kind of troubleshoot how to handle all these things that typically would overwhelm me, lead me to withdraw, lead me to push away the ones that I love, lead me to disconnect or escape and act in a, you know, destructive manner to me and those around me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Well, before I let you go, I would love for you to talk just to the person that may be listening, who is really relating to your story and it's like yeah, man, this is me. You know what. What kind of words of encouragement would you give from your seat post Valiant, now that you're living a life of recovery and you're in it day after day, after day and reflection? You know what would you say to that? What would you say to Jake, you know, back in the summer of 23, pre Valiant, as you're getting ready to go in that Jake today, you know what would give that guy advice? What would you say?
Speaker 2:Let's say first I'd say, stop eating three choc croissants a day, start there. But no, I mean honestly, like the hardest decision you'll make in this journey is is is starting it. It's super scary, it's super, really, really hard. I think for a lot of us, going to treatment is an admission that we failed in whatever it is, which is something that we as humans are not. That's a hard, unnatural thing to do. So my, you know, rip the Band-Aid off as a term I use a lot Still to this day if you're like decisions that I'm wavering on. So just again, no free ads. But Nike said it best just do it. Three months seems 90 days seems like a lifetime, like you're gonna miss all these things and I I have a laundry list of Events and different things that I missed, but it's really not. Then you said this earlier.
Speaker 2:It's really not that much time in the grand scheme of things Right like you're giving up 90 days for me, 180 days for the next 50 years of your life. And if you don't, you know, give up those 90 days, you may have 50 more years of life, but you're gonna be miserable, right, and it's no way to live. Yeah, so just just do it and and Try to, you know, be able to, you know, try to accept that the people there at valiant, which is where you should go, are there to help you and they care about you and they know what they're doing. Because, again, like as an as an addict, like I know these people there. I'm smarter than them, I know what I need, I know I have all the answers.
Speaker 2:No, I, if you know, we all know one shows up because they are doing a good job, like for a gambler. We say, like no one shows up on a heater, you know, like we are unable to manage our lives in a healthy way and is so, you know, an equally hard thing, like asking for help, taking help, like it. That's what the first two weeks really are. It's like that surrender part where you're like Giving up this, like I know it all and I have all the answers, and and just being able to say I don't know what's right for me. Someone you know help me Think through things like that. So yeah, long. That's a long answer for three short words, which is just just do it.
Speaker 1:I love it, jake. Thanks, man. You're, you're our inspiration, and it's not just about Just being a valiant victory, but it's about how you're still putting in the work every day, right. It's not about because you've arrived somewhere, it's that you're, you're in it, man, and you're, you're doing it, and so Grateful for you, man, thanks for sharing your story with us.
Speaker 2:Thanks for thanks for having me, and it's great to see you.
Speaker 1:Well, we appreciate you listening to this episode of the valiant living podcast and our hope is that it helped you feel educated, encouraged, even empowered, on your journey towards peace and freedom. If we can serve you or your loved one in any way, we'd love to have a conversation with you. You can call 720 756 7941 or email admissions. At valiant living calm. At valiant living, we treat the whole person so you not only survive, but you thrive in the life you deserve. And finally, if this episode has been helpful to you, it would mean a lot to us if you subscribe and even share it with your friends and family. You can also follow along with us on Instagram and Facebook by simply searching valiant living. Thanks again for listening and supporting the valiant living podcast. We'll see you next week.